First adventure

[deeknow]

QUOTE (realjumper @ Jun 3 2013,8:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

ILS is fine...no issue whatsoever.
It's getting the AP to track to the VOR setting is what I'm trying to do

VORs will give you an indication about how far off you are tracking a given radial to the position of the VOR but an AP will not usually track to the VOR.
It's up to you to set the HDG for the AP to follow once you intercept that VOR radial.

The AP will track the ILS/LLZ though, which you already have sussed out so thats good.

[realjumper]

QUOTE (deeknow @ Jun 3 2013,8:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

VORs will give you an indication about how far off you are tracking a given radial to the position of the VOR but an AP will not usually track to the VOR. It's up to you to set the HDG for the AP to follow once you intercept that radial
The AP will track the ILS/LLZ thought, which you already have sussed out so thats good.

Ahhhhh.....I seeeee!!! So I'm trying to do the impossible then?!?!?! Ok......so I will manually enter the heading, but keep and eye on the VOR and adjust the AP as necessary for wind drift etc. Is that about right?

[scaber]

QUOTE (realjumper @ Jun 3 2013,8:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hmmm......I still have a lot to learn. Thank you....I'll keep on researching....

Maybe you are not flying in a direction where you will intersect the ILS slope or maybe out of range?? I'm grasping at straws here!

[deeknow]

QUOTE (realjumper @ Jun 3 2013,8:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

so I will manually enter the heading, but keep and eye on the VOR and adjust the AP as necessary for wind drift etc. Is that about right?

You got it !!

[scaber]

QUOTE (realjumper @ Jun 3 2013,8:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ahhhhh.....I seeeee!!! So I'm trying to do the impossible then?!?!?! Ok......so I will manually enter the heading, but keep and eye on the VOR and adjust the AP as necessary for wind drift etc. Is that about right?

I see too, I've been thinking that it was the ILS settings that you were trying to slave the AP to. It's always better to talk head to head rather than via messages as these sorts of things usually get cleared up a bit quicker!

[realjumper]

QUOTE (scaber @ Jun 3 2013,8:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Maybe you are not flying in a direction where you will intersect the ILS slope or maybe out of range?? I'm grasping at straws here!

No, no...you misunderstand......I have no issue whatsoever with ILS!!

It's tracking to VOR that I'm trying to do, but now I understand that that is not possible

[deeknow]

QUOTE (realjumper @ Jun 3 2013,8:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's tracking to VOR that I'm trying to do, but now I understand that that is not possible

Actually, it is possible, both in the sim and w real world APs, but from what I understand they tend to oscillate a lot as they track a VOR which I believe is why a HDG track is used instead.
Hopefully one of our real world instrument rated guns will see this thread?

[realjumper]

QUOTE (deeknow @ Jun 3 2013,9:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, it is possible, both in the sim and w real world APs, but from what I understand they tend to oscillate a lot as they track a VOR which I believe is why a HDG track is used instead.
Hopefully one of our real world instrument rated guns will see this thread?

Ok...many thanks for this information. Just very briefly, if you don't mind.....when I look up Taupo Airport, it seems that there is no VOR there. Other than GPS, which I have yet to tackle, is there another way to navigate there. Don't worry about going too deep into it just now, but if you can point me in the right direction (pardon the pun) I'm happy to research it on my own.

[deeknow]

QUOTE (realjumper @ Jun 3 2013,9:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

when I look up Taupo Airport, it seems that there is no VOR there. Other than GPS, which I have yet to tackle, is there another way to navigate there

Yep, you want the NDB/DME approach, charts here...
http://www.vatnz.net/cms/index.php?option=...p&icao=NZAP

check this out, there are also no doubt lots of vids on youtube...
http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/ndb-appr.htm

[realjumper]

QUOTE (deeknow @ Jun 3 2013,11:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep, you want the NDB/DME approach, charts here...
http://www.vatnz.net/cms/index.php?option=...p&icao=NZAP

check this out, there are also no doubt lots of vids on youtube...
http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/ndb-appr.htm

That's really great....thank you very much

[bjocque]

QUOTE (deeknow @ Jun 3 2013,11:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep, you want the NDB/DME approach, charts here...
http://www.vatnz.net/cms/index.php?option=...p&icao=NZAP

check this out, there are also no doubt lots of vids on youtube...
http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/ndb-appr.htm

cheers deeknow .............

[realjumper]

I have a flight plan for the trip to Queenstown, but the weather has clagged in today, so I'll have another look tomorrow. The plan is:

Wellington depart to:

Nelson Touch & Go
Hokitika T & G
ChCh T & G and a low level flight around the region
Dunedin T & G (have to learn to fly a radial away from the nearest VOR to get to airport
Queenstown Full Stop landing.

Hope the weather is better tomorrow

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (realjumper @ Jun 4 2013,4:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

ChCh T & G and a low level flight around the region

Hope the weather is better tomorrow

It really gone FUBAR here .. so much for the afternoon open sky's ....

[nzav8tor]

Phew self taught instrument flying, good going so far!

Firstly, the 'ON' buttons referred to in an earlier post have nothing to do with the autopilot. This is the audio panel and is unrelated to the autopilot. Its function is to set what the pilot hears in the headset and which radio is being transmitted on. So Comm 1 and 2 refer to transmitting, BOTH is to listen to the frequency on both Comm 1 and Comm 2 radios.
NAV1 and 2 allow you to hear the morse code identifier from any tuned VOR station. This is a series of dot and dash tones that correspond to the VOR name or identifier, Rotorua is RO for instance, .-. --- So when in range you would hear dot dash dot, dash dash dash every few seconds. I can't remember the exact interval but it will repeat continuously while in range.
The DME button is the same, a full explanation is beyond the scope of this quick reply.

MKR is now obsolete but refers to so called marker beacons located on an ILS approach, there are none in NZ nowdays and only a few left elsewhere. (Mostly the USA).

ADF is the same as the NAV1/2 identifier but for the tuned NDB which you will have discovered from the chart for Taupo.

The main difference between the VOR and NDB is that you can choose which radial you want to fly to a VOR (or away from it) and you have the course indicator to line you up. The Automatic Direction Finder picks up the NDB signal (Non-Directional Beacon) and simply points at it. To fly a bearing inbound to an NDB you just orientate the aircraft so the needle is pointing to the bearing you want to fly. This takes a bit of mental visualisation!

I'm not entirely sure why your AP isn't flying to the VOR but heres some steps to make sure you've got everything squared away. (I know you've been doing most of them fine!)

0. Make sure your autopilot and HSI are synced to NAV and not GPS. There is a flip switch on the panel somewhere or you can make a keyboard shortcut in the controls, buttons menu.

1. Tune up your VOR, keep in mind the range of the station at low level won't be more than 50 or 60 nm (I could be way off actually, I don't think FSX is that accurate at terrain masking and so on but the point is that you won't pick up Palmy say when you take off from Auckland!)

2. Turn the OBS knob to centre the Course Direction Indicator (CDI) making sure the little white triangle is pointing toward the top of the Horizontal Situation Indicator (HSI).

3. Rotate the heading 'bug' to line up with the direction of flight. This is the orange bug and the other knob than the CDI knob to rotate it around the HSI bezel.

4. Start by engaging HDG mode on the autopilot to fly the heading you have selected. As stated earlier you can make adjustments to keep the needle centred.

5. Engage NAV on the autopilot and it should track the needle inbound to the station.

Points to bare in mind:

If you are not on a heading to intercept the course you have selected the NAV mode will not engage. So you have to be on an intercept course, the rules of thumb are 30 or 45 degrees off desired track. Basically put the heading bug on top of the fully deflected CDI needle, engage HDG mode and hit NAV. When the CDI comes 'alive' and starts to move the autopilot will drop HDG, change to NAV and turn to intercept the track, voila.

As you approach the station (VOR) the sensitivity of the CDI increases as now the distance between radials originating at the station are much less than at range. (Imagine the spokes on a wheel and the circumference reducing the closer to the hub). So as mentioned earlier, in NAV mode, the autopilot may roll side to side as it tries to keep centered as you get closer to the station. As you cross the station, you enter the so called, 'cone of confusion' where the reading is not reliable. In a few seconds the TO/FROM flag, that little white triangle, will flip to point behind you back toward the station. Once it stabilises you can happily re-engage NAV mode and fly 'outbound' on the same radial. For this reason it is a good idea to change to HDG mode, ensuring you HDG bug is aligned with your track of course, as you cross the station, maybe from 3 miles out until you cross and the needles stabilise heading away from the station.

Let me know if you still have problems using NAV on the autopilot, we'll get to the bottom of it. Oh, if its not already obvious, you can't use NAV mode for NDB tracking, it will only take its info from the NAV 1 radio (or the GPS)!

I'm sure I put some tutorials on here several years ago. I'll see if I can dig them up.

[realjumper]

QUOTE (nzav8tor @ Jun 4 2013,8:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Phew self taught instrument flying, good going so far!

I'm sure I put some tutorials on here several years ago. I'll see if I can dig them up.

Wow.......thank you so much for this great explanation. This is really interesting and once I finish my first cross country to Queenstown.....assuming I don't get lost of course.....I will go through your suggestions each little bit at a time and see what happens. I have already printed out your post so I will be able to follow the steps as I go

The remainder of my cross country flight seems (on the face of it) to be no more difficult that the first leg of the journey in the North Island. The part that I may struggle with is finding Dunedin Airport as the VOR station seems a little bit out from the airport, but I figure if I fly the 211 radial awaf from the VOR I should end up virtually overhead Dunedin Airport. That's the plan anyway.....and I think I know how to fly a particular radial away from the VOR, I just have to intersect the radial and then follow it after I cross the VOR station. Sounds easy....lol....as if!!!

Thank you for taking the time to write this up for me....I appreciate the help.

[nzav8tor]

No worries. There is a DME called Henley HL 115.70 co-located with an NDB, HL 378 just off the end of the 03 threshold but by far the easiest way is to fly the ILS from Swampy. Runway 21 ILS is 109.90. Cross Swampy (SW 112.70) at 3500, tune up the ILS freq and you should intercept the glideslope at 10.7 miles. Use APR instead of NAV and the autopilot will fly both lateral and vertical profiles down to the runway.

These frequencies and the inbound course for the ILS are all viewable in the sim by going to the map or using the flight planner to create a nav log of your tracks and distances. Just select low airways, VOR to VOR or alternatively hit direct between departure and destination then drag the red trackline over any points you want to cross such as the VOR's for a multi leg trip. You can then print the nav log to have next to you during the flight or if you want to save some trees, open the kneeboard and go to nav log there.

[jpreou]

I'm starting to play a little with instruments too. I tend to fly the payware RV-7A and RV-8A.
There's some great freeware scenery out there, though I tend to use ORBX.
For Hamilton, Taupo and some others, FS-Creations do a good job and are free FS-Creations
Also check out Robin Corn's stuff (Windowlight / Godzone) which is really well priced WindowLight
I've got quite a lot of Robin's stuff, but not all of it is ORBX compatible. He's working on a new Wellington, which so far looks fantastic.

[rocky289]

realjumper
If your'e heading to Q'town tomorrow drop in to Wanaka & I'll have a coffee with you.