F-15's ?

[Splitpin]

price aside .... which one? , Iris , or Milviz. Both look pretty good to me .
Just a bit worried about the "min" set up for the Milviz.

I have :AMD 64x2 Dual. 3.2 GHZ , 3.31 gb of Ram.
GTX 460 grapics thingy.

[Ian Warren]

The F-15 , Directly i would recommend the Milviz after the reads .. the Iris would be a cheaper but loss of many features and detail and textures .

[Splitpin]

QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Oct 28 2012,6:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The F-15 , Directly i would recommend the Milviz after the reads .. the Iris would be a cheaper but loss of many features and detail and textures .

Ok ...... thanks Ian, man, i hope this job lasts just one more month

[Ian Warren]

I got a F-16 yonks back and found it ... sorta boring ? , hell i grew up with the development along with the Eagle .. this is were the predecessor's like the F4 /105/104 .. I spoke to a NASA space man .. Brian Duffy .. asked him and pleased asked don't mention the F-15 .. happened he kudo the plane type ... guess if you want to feel the best it would have to a MV model .

[Adamski]

QUOTE (Splitpin @ Oct 28 2012,5:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

price aside .... which one? , Iris , or Milviz. Both look pretty good to me .
Just a bit worried about the "min" set up for the Milviz.

I got the IRIS "Mudhen Driver" when it was on offer a short while back. I really like it - but have no way of comparing with the MILVIZ version.

To be honest, though, I don't really see the point of modern military jets (with modern weapons systems) in FSX. You can't really do much with them - compared to Falcon4 or any DCS sim. The only reason I'd have military jets attacking my wallet would be if they *looked* great ... so ... the Flanker gets my vote and this Sabre.

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (Adamski @ Oct 28 2012,7:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

To be honest, though, I don't really see the point of modern military jets (with modern weapons systems) in FSX. You can't really do much with them -

Smack on the nose , its not the shooting ... its the learning , but also to compare , finding out but also today many people are striving to get the , well what ever Warbird from each era .. and be able to tinker in the cockpit and follow procedure like the real boys do .

Combat sims are for those arenas , maybe FSX can teach people to use those combat sims better , sometimes in a MP comparing two different types really can prove this metal , been tried and tested by a couple of fellow members .

[Adamski]

QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Oct 28 2012,6:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Smack on the nose , its not the shooting ... its the learning , but also to compare , finding out but also today many people are striving to get the , well what ever Warbird from each era .. and be able to tinker in the cockpit and follow procedure like the real boys do .

Combat sims are for those arenas , maybe FSX can teach people to use those combat sims better , sometimes in a MP comparing two different types really can prove this metal , been tried and tested by a couple of fellow members .

I disagree. There's no substitute for doing the learning on the combat sims themselves. All the FSX modern military jets I've used fail miserably in their implementation of the weapons delivery or radar modes. They don't even come close - even compared to a 10yr old sim like Falcon4.

What's worse, is that the flight models in FSX are simply atrocious. Again - comparing with an ancient combat sim like Su-27 Flanker (which had an unnervingly realistic flight model), FSX isn't in the same ball park. Period.

I'd say let FSX do what it does best: civil aircraft - vintage or modern, good weather, great scenery - and let the combat sims do what they do best.

[Ian Warren]

Learn the aircraft ,.. rather than buy just a PC model .. also buy the book and learn it - then you can use that know then you learn the history the weapon system you cannot be FSX 'd , it will never get perfect and fact is you cannot die .. but todays models have got to a stage that if you read the real life exploits , you can put it to practice as long as you follow real setting s.

[Adamski]

QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Oct 28 2012,6:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

but todays models have got to a stage that if you read the real life exploits , you can put it to practice as long as you follow real setting s.

Not in FSX, you can't

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (Adamski @ Oct 28 2012,8:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not in FSX, you can't

Depends how your set it up , but end off the day you cannot be Killed .. dynamics cannot be exacted , but you can learn the general thrill and chase if you no how to use the FS model .. been tried and tested and it works !

[hasegawa]

Opt for MILVIZ... have it here, but not installed at the moment. It is an aircraft with a lot of features, is good in the optics and the cockpit. The Iris is not bad, but the MILVIZ has more to offer.

[Splitpin]

Oh dear .... didnt mean to start a war
Adam, i agree, the old flanker was great, i even upgraded too the "Commanders edition" but as you said , "I'd say let FSX do what it does best: civil aircraft - vintage or modern, good weather, great scenery - and let the combat sims do what they do best."

FSX modern mil jets are just eye candy for me ...... screen fodder if you like, with the odd exception, and those are (so far) the Razbam AV-8 and the MilViz F-86, but again from a pictorial point of view.

[Ian Warren]

No war .. strange , we were only talking about a few minutes ago .. what we did was compare the type .. read were best to use them , in a MP test the theory , CRIPES ! it works !

[Charl]

QUOTE (Adamski @ Oct 28 2012,7:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

...The only reason I'd have military jets attacking my wallet would be if they *looked* great ... so ... the Flanker gets my vote and this Sabre.

I'd agree on both counts, just look at this Fabulous Flanker



...but I'd disagree you can't do anything with them in a civvie sim.
99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of military flying is under civilian rules, and no armed weapons.

The shot above is inverted, at 65,000ft, how's your Cessna now??

Let's highjack Marty's F-15 thread completely then, with the most serious of competition

[Splitpin]

Indeed Charl ..... great screens

[Charl]

Sorry Marty, c'mon show us your Eagle, then.

[AlisterC]

Great pics Charl. She is a beauty!

[Splitpin]

QUOTE (Charl @ Oct 29 2012,9:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry Marty, c'mon show us your Eagle, then.

Soon, master....soon, just have to pay for it

[Adamski]

QUOTE (Charl @ Oct 29 2012,8:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'd agree on both counts, just look at this Fabulous Flanker

Whose "fabulous" Flanker is that? Looks amazing!

QUOTE (Charl @ Oct 29 2012,8:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

...but I'd disagree you can't do anything with them in a civvie sim.
99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of military flying is under civilian rules, and no armed weapons.

Just to complete the hijacking (sorry Marty ) - I have to say I disagree (this is getting monotonous!).

Though (I agree) most military flying may not be using armed weapons (except A2G over practice ranges), military pilots spend a *lot* of time learning and honing their BVR skills and multiple target tactics. They also need to be *totally* familiar not only with the flight envelope of their own aircraft, but also that of their opposition's.

Over the years of being involved in (beta testing) combat sims, I've met military pilots that have used not only full-blown professional sims but also public/commercial ones:

1) An F-16 pilot that regularly flew "Su-27 Flanker" (as did others in his squadron) because the flight model was that authentic and that even without TrackIR (or whatever), they could practise dogfighting tactics (all about turning circle radius, turn rates, corner speeds etc.).

2) A very famous Russian Su-27 pilot (you know the one) who also claimed the same sim was extremely useful - and faithful to the real thing. LOMAC took it a stage further.

3) A couple of Tornado pilots that actually used the Digital Integration "Tornado" sim for practising mission planning (honest!!).

I dread to think how many hours I've spent (in the past) in these combat sims (not to mention IL-2 etc.). I've also spent massive amounts of time in MSFS. I honestly don't think I've tried a single military jet add-on that comes anywhere near useful in flight model terms. Yes - you can jump into a multiplayer session and "pretend" ... but it really isn't anywhere near as "realistic" as [even] those 10yr old combat sims.

As for weapons ... anyone that's tried Falcon4 or the DCS A-10 will know that there's a lot to learn about weaponry systems. Even the most complex FSX military add-ons I've tried don't model more than about 10% of what is available in those combat sims - let alone *fire them* (or avoid them). Can you practise A2A or SAM missile avoidance tactics in FSX?

What I *do* agree on - if it's on the level of "eye candy", then I'm up for it!

I think I'll leave that as my final bleat!!!

[jeansy]

I got both Milviz and Iris

sum it quickly

Iris: Pros: More 3rd party paints, slightly cheaper
Cons: like usual no Iris support, no/very limited working radar modes, no working weapons, not a fan of the FDE, looks cartoon-ish both in and out

Milviz: pros: all radar modes, working weapons, I like the FDE, instant support, refundable, Plus several flightsim awards across the net
Cons: I think maybe 2 3rd party paints, slightly more expensive ie a few dollars,

At times for me theyre both the same for FPS, sometimes the Milviz is slightly less ie maybe 2-3 fps less but not really noticeable and I dont have a flash machine

The Iris bird lasted about 2wks with very limited use, while the milviz still remains installed

Iris have been very very poor in the past in responding to support questions and there are 100s posts across the forums expressing anger at this and the developer of the IRIS F15 leaving them to work with RAZBAM and DCS and his solo venture

My call, go the Milviz F15, if you dont like you can get your money back within 30days no questions asked, unlike Iris who dont respond to support requests, its like in the rotor world comparing Nemeth Designs to Aerosoft or Cerasim bit of a no brainer IMHO